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Painful punchlines
CARRIE ON Callahan soldiers through even the toughest crowds.Photo: Bryan Bowden“We’ve got lots of dames,” comedian Ken Barnard quips about the Lincoln Lodge stand-up cast. “And we treat ’em real nice.”
Pretty harmless joke, right? Well, it depends who you ask. It’s no secret that sexist and misogynistic jokes run rampant in the Chicago stand-up scene: Blow jobs and bitchy girlfriends seem to be topics of choice among male comics. (One recent bit by Junior Stopka, who performs at Comedians You Should Know (CYSK) and the Edge Comedy Club, goes, “Whatever happened to slipping a girl a roofie, taking her home and just holding her?”) Yet eradicating such quips requires navigating the blurry line between artistic freedom and social sensitivity—which might be an impossible thing to pull off. Though Barnard concedes his wisecrack could be construed as sexist, he says, “A lot of it is in the context of the joke.”
But context is an especially fraught concept within the community. The recent influx of up-and-coming, male-run stand-up nights—Comedy House and CYSK among them—has swung the spotlight onto the boys’-club vibe, and most comedians admit that the open-mike circuit is a breeding ground for the worst offenders: rape jokes, the casual use of derogatory terms and antifeminist rants. “Open mikes will let anyone go up there and talk about whatever they want,” says Victor Marinier, a coproducer at Comedy House. “There are so many hack comedians who will see an audience full of women, be intimidated by that and then try to offend them.”
Actually, it’s pretty rare for any stand-up to see an audience full of women, especially since all-male line-ups are a dime a dozen in a community that’s dominated by men. Among the small but vocal group of women comics speaking out against sexist jokes, Carrie Callahan was shocked when a performer she introduced while hosting a show said he “would fuck” her. “I no longer think ignorance is an excuse,” she says. At a recent open mike, she felt the need to use part of her allotted time on stage to call out the previous male comic’s overuse of the word cunt. “I don’t want all my material to be in reaction,” she says. “I think there’s this temptation to throw the meanness back at them. But once you react that way, their action becomes valid.”
Yet such humor has its defenders. “I don’t think any comics are actually like, ‘I’m gonna beat a woman for talking out of turn,’ ” says Dave Odd, producer of the Edge Comedy Club. “If anything, it’s mocking chauvinism.” In other words: They’re just joking.
Odd runs two shows in particular that have riled some members of the stand-up community. “There were a bunch of really attractive girls doing stand-up comedy, so I [thought], ‘Why not use that to our advantage to try and draw a crowd?’ ” Odd explains. “So I came up with the clever name of Ha Ha Hotties. Yeah, it’s all female, but at the same time, it’s kind of, like, exploiting them.” But his press e-mails say, “What’s better than a hot body and great face? A good joke!”—isn’t exploitation the issue? “The thing is,” Odd adds, “I [also] do a show called Handsome Bastards of Comedy, which is all just good-looking guy comics. So I kind of spread the sexism around a bit.”
Callahan, an occasional Hotties performer, says the show provides good networking opportunities among female comics, noting that talk often turns to commiseration: performing in an all-girl lineup and not dealing with the scene’s sexism, if just for a night.
Clearly, that sexism isn’t going away anytime soon, but Elizabeth McQuern, a Chicago Underground Comedy coproducer (and one of the few female bookers in the city), believes good comedy always prevails. “Negative, hateful comedy isn’t fun for anyone, and it’s lazy,” says McQuern, who also edits comedy blog the Bastion. “When you see someone breaking through with something truly creative, people respond to it so well that hopefully more of that will encourage us all to hold ourselves to higher standards.”
Comedy House opens up Thursday 24. The next Ha Ha Hotties is August 1.
Time Out Chicago / Issue 178 : Jul 24–30, 2008
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Nobody is much going to give a hoot about female comics as long as people like Cindy Cornelsen try to get a laugh doing jokes about Hillary Clinton's dick.
being the funniest comedian in chicago, i felt i should comment on this matter. any joke i have made about women that includes any type of sexual reference, has come about by experiences from women. if women didn't give blowjobs, have sex on the first night men meet them, or have anal sex, we wouldn't make jokes about them. when it comes to women/sex jokes, we merely take what we have experienced and TRY to make it funny. Is it always funny, no.
But i thought that what open mics were for anyway, to test new material. As stated in your article, most of the people in the audience are men, therefore, our target audience are mostly men, and all men talk about sex with women amongst themselves when not in front of a crowd. if there was a room full of women, maybe we would tell jokes about dandelions and unicorns with a menstrual cycle joke peppered in.
Wow - what perfect timing! Penn & Teller just did an entire episode about "SENSITIVITY" - covering all of the themes of this article. Wanna find out why sensitivity is bullshit? Here is a link to the full episode of "PENN & TELLER: BULLSHIT: SENSITIVITY TRAINING" http://switchpod.com/users/redbarradio/ftp/bullshit-sensitivity.mov
What's the difference between an anti-feminist rant and a feminist rant? Think about it kids.
I'm sick of comedians taking themselves so seriously. There is the PC world known as everyday life and than there are the comedy shows I go to in order to get away from that world. Who cares who is being offended? The only question you should ask yourself is, "Is it funny?" So you don't find offensive jokes to be funny? Then don't do them! For those comics who do push the envelope and aren't afraid to offend everyone in the room on an occasion, bravo.
I'm just wondering why none of the Black or Latino comics from the South side get called out by name for being FAR more sexist and saying MUCH worse things than Junior Stopka. Much in the same manner that Don Imus is crucified publicly for saying "nappy headed hoes" and literally thousands of rappers every day say much worse. The fascistic element displayed here at the behest of one hurt, angry woman is mindblowing. Is the answer to silence everyone? Is that really what we want?
It's not that the content itself is offensive, it's that sometimes people really are speaking from a place of hatred and intolerance when they tell these jokes. And just as your conscience wouldn't let you hear that kind of talk at work or at home and allow your silence to make you complicit in the fostering of hatred, you have to address this in the comedy sphere of your life, as well. Also, "fart." And "dick." P.S. "masturbation."
Are you quoting a quote from Patton Oswalt from some Dan Telfer interview? You know if someone actually has experience in the field that they are giving advice or talking about, they wouldn't have to quote other people because they would actually have their own experiences to draw on. Just saying.
Comedians tell jokes about what they know and their life experiences. Men date women, marry women, have kids with women, etc. I love women but women have also driven me crazy, broken my heart, and pissed me off. So occasionally I'm going to make jokes about it. "She takes just like a woman, she aches just like a woman, and she makes love just like a woman, but she breaks just like a little girl"~Bob Dylan
There are a slew of frustrated up and coming comedians out there that do find the aggressive open mic vibe referenced in this article quite appalling, but what TO fails to mention is that due to this dissatisfaction several performers have gone out and created their own spaces in coffeehouses, bookstores, and galleries across the city. The underground of the underground! "Go on stage a lot...create your own venues"-P. Oswalt; The Bastion interview by Dan Telfer.
I think this discussion is like "trying to unravel a cable-knit sweater that someone keeps knitting and knitting and knitting" (thank you , Pee Wee) -- If you follow this conversation to the end...well, it turns out the world is run by men ... so it would follow that people would make jokes about/ around the power men have over women... though many of the jokes being made are pretty unsophisticated ones -- And the guy who said he'd "f" Carrie should keep his brilliant comedy in the locker room.
I'm glad to see that TOC is continually committed to covering the burgeoning indie stand-up scene here. Warts and all.
One of the things I said that wasn't published that I said was this; A stand-up comic has to be the type of person who wants to command the attention of a room full of people with a spotlight on them and microphone in their hand. That is a very ego driven desire, and for the most part it is men that have that desire. Hence the reason why there are so few female comics in comparison to the amount of males. That is because males are ego driven assholes, and for the most part women are not.
The whole message of this article backtracks on it's intended purpose by basically putting female comics into this perceived position of powerlessness in a male dominated field. I think most of the girls I mentioned below can hold their own in any of the "boys club" rooms in the Chicago scene without breaking a sweat, and certainly without complaining or being offended by any "rude" or chauvinistic jokes. Shit some of those girls tell more inappropriate rape and abortion jokes than the boys.
This a a list of all the female comics that perform in Chicago; Kat, Beth Stelling, Tiffany Puterbaugh, Emily Dorezas, Allison Leber, Carrie Callahan, Molly Moon, Lauren Vino, Julianna Forlanno, Jet Eveleth, Michelle Renee Thompson, Katie Canavan, Christine Parisi, Rachel Labant, Hollie Himmelman, Cindy Cornelsen, Subah, Cameron Esposito, Leah Eva, Fay Canale, Jena Friedman, Staci Fletcher, and there's probably a bunch I'm forgetting and from the south side. There are more than four.
Of course more women were not asked to comment. Because at the time of the article we were all in my Kitchen making a roast for the male comics of the scene. Don't worry it wasn't sexist there was a rapey blow job in the end. Boners boners Goddess power Ladies are sweet we all came from one so respect. Vagina vagina magic johnson aids.......Comedy can be offensive aren't we glad were not politicians. Cuz then we would have to sensor what we say
In an article tarring and feathering the entire stand-up community with a 'sexist' brush why were the three largest venues (Zanies, The Improv and Lakeshore Theater) ommited for comment from the article? Commercial considerations? Regards, Mark Geary Executive Producer - The Lincoln Lodge.
With all due respect to the writer, I can't agree with this bit from the article: "It’s no secret that sexist and misogynistic jokes run rampant in the Chicago stand-up scene: Blow jobs and bitchy girlfriends seem to be topics of choice among male comics." Granted, I have not been to every room and every show in the city, but by and large this scene's male comedians are great people and nice guys, and they're much more creative than that statement gives them credit for.
There is a considerable discussion about this article taking place on the Bastion - http://www.thebastion.org/2008/07/time_out_chicago_painful_punch.html
Terrible.
This is a really interesting article, and I hope that while people's attention is focused on this issue they'll make an effort to see some of the great female comics in this city. Cameron Esposito, Allison Leber, Fay Canale, and Beth Stelling are all consistently doing hilarious, unique comedy. I'm very proud of the Lincoln Lodge, where we make an effort to book women and create a welcoming atmosphere for female audience members. Ken Barnard especially has been a big part of that effort.
Sorry, I went over the word count and worded something poorly- I shouldn't have said "in this particular case", I mean "often in this case". My sentence doesn't really makes sense as it's written!
Great article! I personally believe something comedian Jimmy Carr says- being PC is an important social construct that we shouldn't dismiss, but comedians should be exempt. The problem then is that in this particular case, the comedian clearly is no different in their attitudes offstage. They can say "hey, just a joke, lighten up ladies!" but clearly they don't have a personal respect for women to back up the joke they were attempting under the stage lights. Anyhow, good stuff.